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Incident at Hampden Park level crossing

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Incident at Hampden Park level crossing

Unread postby John Webb » Wed Feb 18, 2015 6:25 pm

Report of a wheelchair being caught between barriers at the above crossing - see http://www.eastbourneherald.co.uk/news/breaking-news-men-rescue-disabled-woman-trapped-at-hampden-park-level-crossing-1-6586705
(Although reports are not entirely in agreement as to exactly what happened, it seems.)
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Re: Incident at Hampden Park level crossing

Unread postby S&TEngineer » Wed Feb 18, 2015 7:06 pm

.....mmm. Only commissioned last Monday morning (16 February 2015). The crossing is MCB-CCTV with auto lower supervised from Three Bridges ROC. Quite likely the signaller may have not been watching the CCTV monitor at the time the barriers were lowering (no requirement for him/her to do so).
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Re: Incident at Hampden Park level crossing

Unread postby LlaniGraham » Wed Feb 18, 2015 8:37 pm

A very one-sided story from the paper, and some of the "facts" don't add up.
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Re: Incident at Hampden Park level crossing

Unread postby John Webb » Wed Feb 18, 2015 9:02 pm

Further comments on the UKRail forum since I first saw this subject raised there, indicate that in fact the lowering barriers were halted by the signaller until the three people had assisted the wheelchair and its mover clear of the crossing.
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Re: Incident at Hampden Park level crossing

Unread postby Mike Hodgson » Thu Feb 19, 2015 2:23 am

For once this does not sound like unfair reporting. All they have got out of Network Rail was a statement that they were looking at what had happened. Nothing in the press report to suggest that the signaller had pressed crossing clear, so there should have been no danger of anybody being struck by a train, but the public weren't to know that. And it would be likely that he would have pressed the button as soon as they had all been safely extricated, so the train would have arrived shortly after that, thereby confirming the impression given to those involved that they had nearly been hit by a train.

I assume this incident should not have occurred had it been MCB-OD
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Re: Incident at Hampden Park level crossing

Unread postby Fast Line Floyd » Thu Feb 19, 2015 11:29 am

Mike Hodgson wrote:I assume this incident should not have occurred had it been MCB-OD

OD crossings should prevent the exit barrier from lowering if an obstruction is detected so arguably yes it would have been different but I suspect that this crossing is too busy to qualify for OD protection.

The signaller is not (as previously stated) required to view the crossing during the lowering sequence and indeed may be too busy to do so, the only requirement is that the crossing must be viewed to confirm that it is clear before the 'crossing clear' button is pressed.

The question that remains is does the crossing have enough time in the lowering sequence so that when someone slow passes the entrance barrier with the lights out and the yodel alarm silent and reach the other side before the exit barrier comes down, the answer is almost certainly yes it will, so what remains is did the people involved start to cross after the lower sequence had started or was there a malfunction causing the crossing sequence to run too quickly. The answer to that should be found from the crossing data logger and the CCTV picture recordings.
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Re: Incident at Hampden Park level crossing

Unread postby Stuart Johnson » Thu Feb 19, 2015 12:24 pm

Bear in mind that a pedestrian on the right-hand side of the road may find themselves facing the entrance barrier as it lowers first, and have to move into the roadway to reach the exit side.
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Re: Incident at Hampden Park level crossing

Unread postby S&TEngineer » Thu Feb 19, 2015 1:01 pm

Also note that the Up direction protecting signal EB1378 at the end of Hampden Park station is only 22m from the edge of the crossing and train can approach the signal at danger with the barriers up or lowering (it is also fitted with SPAD prediction circuits) so this can give the impression that a train is coming!
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Re: Incident at Hampden Park level crossing

Unread postby Fast Line Floyd » Thu Feb 19, 2015 3:09 pm

Stuart Johnson wrote:Bear in mind that a pedestrian on the right-hand side of the road may find themselves facing the entrance barrier as it lowers first, and have to move into the roadway to reach the exit side.

Yes of course I suppose I was assuming that the person was walking towards the exit barrier but then if they were walking towards the entrance barrier surely they would have seen the get out via the still raised exit barrier and headed towards it?
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Re: Incident at Hampden Park level crossing

Unread postby Danny252 » Thu Feb 19, 2015 5:44 pm

I suspect an important factor here is the wheelchair. Having had experience of wheelchair users crossing lines on the level, it's generally a slow process due to having to avoid getting the smaller front wheels lodged in the gaps for the rails, especially for those who are inexperienced with the process. Speaking anecdotally, wheelchair users are generally the group that I see having the most close calls with trains on pedestrian crossings, due to the reduced speed at which they cross the track.
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Re: Incident at Hampden Park level crossing

Unread postby Mike Hodgson » Thu Feb 19, 2015 5:47 pm

I wasn't advocating making it OD! I'd much rather have a signalman or crossing keeper in charge of it. The question the authorities will have to address is whether it would be justifiable to require barriers to be watched coming down. The provision of emergency stop buttons on barrier pedestals seems rather pointless if nobody watches.

Fast Line Floyd wrote:The question that remains is does the crossing have enough time in the lowering sequence so that when someone slow passes the entrance barrier with the lights out and the yodel alarm silent and reach the other side before the exit barrier comes down, the answer is almost certainly yes it will, so what remains is did the people involved start to cross after the lower sequence had started or was there a malfunction causing the crossing sequence to run too quickly. The answer to that should be found from the crossing data logger and the CCTV picture recordings.



Indeed, but the press report does claim the crossing sequence had not started when they started to cross. An elderly person pushing a wheelchair is the pedestrian equivalent of the "Large or slow vehicle" that AHB signs require permission to cross. Whatever period of time you allow them to cross, there is always going to be somebody even slower. Given that this particular crossing is said to be so busy, extending the period is unlikely to be a practical solution.
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Re: Incident at Hampden Park level crossing

Unread postby Yabbadabba » Fri Mar 27, 2015 10:06 pm

S&TEngineer wrote:.....mmm. Only commissioned last Monday morning (16 February 2015). The crossing is MCB-CCTV with auto lower supervised from Three Bridges ROC. Quite likely the signaller may have not been watching the CCTV monitor at the time the barriers were lowering (no requirement for him/her to do so).


Looking at the various scheme plans I have for the Sussex East Coastway re-signalling, Hampden Park MCB-CCTVs was altered to manual lower and not auto lower as per the earlier plans. That was also confirmed to me by one of my managers who liassed with the project engineers. Also when I used the simulator in the ROC it was manual lower.
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Re: Incident at Hampden Park level crossing

Unread postby S&TEngineer » Sat Mar 28, 2015 2:16 pm

Yabbadabba wrote:
S&TEngineer wrote:.....mmm. Only commissioned last Monday morning (16 February 2015). The crossing is MCB-CCTV with auto lower supervised from Three Bridges ROC. Quite likely the signaller may have not been watching the CCTV monitor at the time the barriers were lowering (no requirement for him/her to do so).


Looking at the various scheme plans I have for the Sussex East Coastway re-signalling, Hampden Park MCB-CCTVs was altered to manual lower and not auto lower as per the earlier plans. That was also confirmed to me by one of my managers who liassed with the project engineers. Also when I used the simulator in the ROC it was manual lower.

OK. Obviously changed after the Scheme Plan version I had access to.
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