Signals

THE SIGNAL BOX


Railway signalling discussion

Identification of photographs

British signalling of the past (UK, excepting Northern Ireland)

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby davidwoodcock » Fri Feb 26, 2016 12:44 pm

Fast Line Floyd wrote:The box was actually the GW Grove Road Junction, I have a poor ish photo of it also.


The box I have in mind was definitely the L&SWR one, a little north of the former L&SWR platforms and at the junction where the erstwhile connection to the H&C had gone off. Roughly opposite the southern end of the H&C depot building IIRC.

It had obviously controlled the L&SWR end of the H&C connection but would have been required as a block post anyway.

I believe that at one time there had been a Paddington-Richmond (New) service which used the connection.
davidwoodcock
Rest-day relief
Rest-day relief
 
Posts: 934
Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2011 7:58 am
Location: Champlon, Belgique

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby Fast Line Floyd » Fri Feb 26, 2016 12:59 pm

davidwoodcock wrote:
Fast Line Floyd wrote:The box was actually the GW Grove Road Junction, I have a poor ish photo of it also.


The box I have in mind was definitely the L&SWR one, a little north of the former L&SWR platforms and at the junction where the erstwhile connection to the H&C had gone off. Roughly opposite the southern end of the H&C depot building IIRC.

It had obviously controlled the L&SWR end of the H&C connection but would have been required as a block post anyway.

I believe that at one time there had been a Paddington-Richmond (New) service which used the connection.

Ok I have no memory of that but you may well be right.
Graham
User avatar
Fast Line Floyd
Main line box
Main line box
 
Posts: 1616
Joined: Tue May 26, 2009 11:42 am
Location: Raunds

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby GeoffSmith » Sat Feb 27, 2016 10:09 am

davidwoodcock wrote:The box I have in mind was definitely the L&SWR one, a little north of the former L&SWR platforms and at the junction where the erstwhile connection to the H&C had gone off. Roughly opposite the southern end of the H&C depot building IIRC.

It had obviously controlled the L&SWR end of the H&C connection but would have been required as a block post anyway.

Image
Photo : Geoff Smith Collection
Last edited by GeoffSmith on Sun Feb 28, 2016 4:27 pm, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
GeoffSmith
Crossing box
Crossing box
 
Posts: 91
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2008 10:04 am

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby John Hinson » Sat Feb 27, 2016 10:15 am

The one I was thinking of was the GW one Graham mentioned. I don't remember the other one.

John
Image
‹(•¿•)›
User avatar
John Hinson
Site Admin
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6751
Joined: Thu Nov 8, 2007 1:13 pm
Location: at my computer

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby Russell Maiden » Sat Feb 27, 2016 5:27 pm

The 'Britain from the Air' picture at the url: http://www.britainfromabove.org.uk/imag ... mith&ref=0 shows the H&C line from where it passed over the K&R formation to the Grove Road station including the formation of the wartime (WW1) connection. It shows Grove Road Jn box (the one I have sent John a copy of but which I thought was Hammersmith Jn) and two others mentioned in recent posts.

Russell.
Russell Maiden
User avatar
Russell Maiden
Branch line box
Branch line box
 
Posts: 127
Joined: Fri Nov 9, 2007 12:36 pm
Location: London

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby John Hinson » Sat Feb 27, 2016 5:45 pm

. . . and here it is, with thanks to Russell:
Image
Photo: Russell Maiden

John
Image
‹(•¿•)›
User avatar
John Hinson
Site Admin
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6751
Joined: Thu Nov 8, 2007 1:13 pm
Location: at my computer

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby GeoffSmith » Sat Feb 27, 2016 10:02 pm

John Hinson wrote:. . . and here it is, with thanks to Russell:

I understood Grove Road Jc to be the LSWR box in the picture I posted earlier, just above the word "Air".
On the Aerofilms site someone has captioned the box at the H&C end of the connection as Grove Road Jc..
Despite the caption, this appears to be that box
Image
Photo : Geoff Smith Collection



So where is the box in Russell's picture?


Russell Maiden wrote:The 'Britain from the Air' picture at the url: http://www.britainfromabove.org.uk/imag ... mith&ref=0 shows the H&C line from where it passed over the K&R formation to the Grove Road station including the formation of the wartime (WW1) connection.

Connecting line opened 1/6/1870 closed 1/11/1870, reopened 1/10/1877 closed 1/1/1911.
Used by GWR and Met services to Richmond.
The SRS SB Register says Grove Road Jc LSWR box opened "00.12.68", "aka Hammersmith Jc" - whatever aka means in this context.
Last edited by GeoffSmith on Sun Feb 28, 2016 4:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
GeoffSmith
Crossing box
Crossing box
 
Posts: 91
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2008 10:04 am

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby Chris Osment » Sun Feb 28, 2016 9:15 am

aka = also known as :-)
Chris Osment
West Country Railway Archives
http://www.railwest.org.uk
User avatar
Chris Osment
Main line box
Main line box
 
Posts: 2234
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2007 9:32 am
Location: Somewhere in the West Country

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby GeoffSmith » Sun Feb 28, 2016 9:18 am

Chris Osment wrote:aka = also known as :-)

As I said, in this context.

"aka Hammersmith Jc" :
Does it mean Grove Road Jc LSWR box was once named Hammersmith Jc?
That whoever thought that couldn't put a date to it?
Or that it was just some vague idea that some now unidentifiable person had, which has found its way into the Register?
User avatar
GeoffSmith
Crossing box
Crossing box
 
Posts: 91
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2008 10:04 am

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby John Hinson » Sun Feb 28, 2016 10:02 am

It will mean that some documentation somewhere refers to the box under that name, but it doesn't necessarily mean that was ever the formal name of the box. It is quite common to find various names for one location in early documents - in those days the actual name of the box may not have carried the significance it does now.

John
Image
‹(•¿•)›
User avatar
John Hinson
Site Admin
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6751
Joined: Thu Nov 8, 2007 1:13 pm
Location: at my computer

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby GeoffSmith » Sun Feb 28, 2016 10:23 am

John Hinson wrote:It will mean that some documentation somewhere refers to the box under that name, but it doesn't necessarily mean that was ever the formal name of the box. It is quite common to find various names for one location in early documents - in those days the actual name of the box may not have carried the significance it does now.

John


Quite so, although I would say "probably mean" as there are clear indications that some 'facts' in the SB Register have been accepted, unchecked, from modern books.
I've been through more than enough inspection reports at Kew to know that the names of places and boxes used by the Inspecting Officer, and even the Company, often don't match what is now regarded as a matter of record. My point, not well expressed admittedly, is that I expect an SB Register to be just that - a record. Otherwise, why not include "aka Grove Jc", the name given on the 1895 OS map?
Best leave it at that.
User avatar
GeoffSmith
Crossing box
Crossing box
 
Posts: 91
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2008 10:04 am

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby John Hinson » Sun Feb 28, 2016 2:46 pm

GeoffSmith wrote:Quite so, although I would say "probably mean" as there are clear indications that some 'facts' in the SB Register have been accepted, unchecked, from modern books.

If that is the case I would recommend contacting the editor to notify errors of that sort. These volumes are an incredible task to compile and being realistic errors will inevitably creep in. They are onwardly updated with new information so corrections of that sort are easily included and worth including.

John
Image
‹(•¿•)›
User avatar
John Hinson
Site Admin
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6751
Joined: Thu Nov 8, 2007 1:13 pm
Location: at my computer

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby Chris Osment » Sun Feb 28, 2016 8:27 pm

John Hinson wrote:
GeoffSmith wrote:Quite so, although I would say "probably mean" as there are clear indications that some 'facts' in the SB Register have been accepted, unchecked, from modern books.

If that is the case I would recommend contacting the editor to notify errors of that sort. These volumes are an incredible task to compile and being realistic errors will inevitably creep in. They are onwardly updated with new information so corrections of that sort are easily included and worth including.

John


Indeed. In the course of my researches I make reference to the relevant Registers and occasionally find odd 'quirks' or seemingly dubious entries, so a note about the entry in question issue is sent to the SRS along with supporting details. Sometimes the discrepancy can not be resolved at that time, but it is always useful to make the contact anyway in case more details come to light later.
Chris Osment
West Country Railway Archives
http://www.railwest.org.uk
User avatar
Chris Osment
Main line box
Main line box
 
Posts: 2234
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2007 9:32 am
Location: Somewhere in the West Country

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby Fast Line Floyd » Mon Feb 29, 2016 9:33 am

A trawl of the maps around Hammersmith and Shepherds Bush reveal that there is no road called Grove Road however around where the Great Western box was are a number of roads called something Grove including Hammersmith Grove, Grove Mews, Cromwell Grove and Poplar Grove but the actual road where the GW box was located is called Trussley Road. However my brain finally kicked in when I spotted Studland Street just east of Ravenscourt Park Station and I seem to recall someone (old enough to remember) refering to the LSWR Junction as Studland Road Junction.
Graham
User avatar
Fast Line Floyd
Main line box
Main line box
 
Posts: 1616
Joined: Tue May 26, 2009 11:42 am
Location: Raunds

Re: Identification of photographs

Unread postby Russell Maiden » Mon Feb 29, 2016 10:05 am

Graham,

At the risk of going too far off-topic, Studland Road Jn was where the L&SWR Kensington & Richmond and MDR lines met just East of Ravenscourt Park Station. I believe the next box towards Kensington on the L&SWR might have been the one at Grove Road Station. The K&R viaduct can still be seen between the Eastbound District and Piccadilly lines, eventually stopping just before an office building on the line of route.

If memory serves correctly there are other refences to Studland Road Jn in the topic 'Turnham Green or Fisher's Lane' a while back.

Maybe, if this part of the thread 'grows' John may decide to hive it off to a new topic?

Russell.
Russell Maiden
User avatar
Russell Maiden
Branch line box
Branch line box
 
Posts: 127
Joined: Fri Nov 9, 2007 12:36 pm
Location: London

PreviousNext

Return to Signalling - historical

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 2 guests