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East Kent Resignalling Scheme Phase 2 and associated works

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Re: East Kent Resignalling Scheme Phase 2 and associated wor

Unread postby Peter Gibbons » Mon Apr 18, 2016 12:04 pm

davidwoodcock wrote:
Peter Gibbons wrote:....... All the signal boxes /panels from the Kent Coast Electrification Phase 1 scheme of 1969 have now been abolished.......


Slight slip of the keyboard there, Phase 1 scheme of 1959 not 1969, and I suspect that the first box commissionings of that scheme may have been in 1958 rather than 1959. All seems like pre-history now!



Yes, agreed there was a light slip of the keyboard. The date should have read 1959, not 1969.

However all the Kent Coast Electrification Phase 1 signal panel boxes were all opened between March and May 1959 according the the Signalling Record Society's own publications which shows:-

Shepherds Lane (opened 08/03/1959, closed 29/11/1981) This box contained a Westinghouse Style 'L' miniature lever frame instead of a panel, now demolished.
Beckenham Junction (opened 12/04/1959, closed 20/06/1982), now demolished.
Shortlands Junction (opened on 31/05/1959, closed 20/06/1982), still extant.
Chislehurst Junction (opened 26/04/1959, closed 21/02/1993) now demolished.
Rochester (opened 10/05/1959, closed 25/03/2016) now demolished.
Rainham (opened 26/04/1959, closed 25/03/2016) still extant.
Sittingbourne (opened 24/05/1959, closed 25/03/2016) still extant.
Faversham (opened 24/05/1959, closed 25/12/2011) still extant.

All the other signal boxes on the route pre-date the electrification scheme and all these boxes contained full length lever frames suitably adapted for working colour light signals and track circuit block.
Last edited by Peter Gibbons on Mon Apr 18, 2016 4:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: East Kent Resignalling Scheme Phase 2 and associated wor

Unread postby Stuart Johnson » Mon Apr 18, 2016 12:27 pm

Peter Gibbons wrote:Deal signal box is the very last signal box in Kent still operating semaphore signals on the National Rail system.

To avoid confusion, that's in Kent, as distinct from on the (former) Kent route, of course, in which Hastings' semaphores also survive, and signal box, as distinct from ground frame, because Grain Crossing still controls semaphores. 8)
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Re: East Kent Resignalling Scheme Phase 2 and associated wor

Unread postby colin1501 » Mon Apr 18, 2016 1:06 pm

Is that closure date for Chislehurst Junction right (25/03/2016)? I thought it was out of use long before that.

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Re: East Kent Resignalling Scheme Phase 2 and associated wor

Unread postby Peter Gibbons » Mon Apr 18, 2016 4:55 pm

colin1501 wrote:Is that closure date for Chislehurst Junction right (25/03/2016)? I thought it was out of use long before that.

Colin


Dohh. Yes of course Chislehurst Junction closed long ago on 21/02/1993. Note to self - must read my replies before posting! i'll correct my original post. Thanks for pointing it out.
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Re: East Kent Resignalling Scheme Phase 2 and associated wor

Unread postby John Hinson » Fri Apr 22, 2016 8:59 am

Cannon Street discussion moved to:
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7569

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Re: East Kent Resignalling Scheme Phase 2 and associated wor

Unread postby blue » Tue May 3, 2016 8:35 pm

Peter Gibbons wrote:
colin1501 wrote:Is that closure date for Chislehurst Junction right (25/03/2016)? I thought it was out of use long before that.

Colin


Dohh. Yes of course Chislehurst Junction closed long ago on 21/02/1993. Note to self - must read my replies before posting! i'll correct my original post. Thanks for pointing it out.


I had the honour of doing the last late turn in Chislehurst box. It was such a strange feeling watching various S&T bods coming in and stripping bits and bobs. It was also a little odd watching one walking out with the emergency block bell!
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Re: East Kent Resignalling Scheme Phase 2 and associated wor

Unread postby TerryH » Sun May 29, 2016 11:39 am

Thanks for the plan.

I am puzzled by the provision of the flashing yellow at Rainham instead of the feather. I have only seen it used once so that the drivers do not know if the route to Newington station is set before they leave Rainham.

The map does not show that there was a crossover to the east of Rainham before resignalling.

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Re: East Kent Resignalling Scheme Phase 2 and associated wor

Unread postby Peter Gibbons » Mon May 30, 2016 11:05 am

TerryH wrote:Thanks for the plan.

I am puzzled by the provision of the flashing yellow at Rainham instead of the feather. I have only seen it used once so that the drivers do not know if the route to Newington station is set before they leave Rainham.

The map does not show that there was a crossover to the east of Rainham before resignalling.

Terry Hackett


There is no need for a feather because there is now a new signal much closer to the points where the Down Newington Loop line starts. This new signal EK163 is equipped with a feather. Unless there are exceptional circumstances, I would have thought that the route would have been set as far ahead as is possible.

The crossover that was east of the Rainham station was not part of the scheme to re-signalled, so would have been taken out of use immediately following the re-signalling and may well have been removed by now.
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Re: East Kent Resignalling Scheme Phase 2 and associated wor

Unread postby JG Morgan » Tue Jun 7, 2016 5:50 pm

The crossover at Rainham was removed BEFORE the resignalling, as per my posting of April 1st, 2016, 9:25 pm (previous page).

A couple more questions, if I may?
Why are three-state repeaters needed for up direction moves at Rochester? I can see the need at places such as St Albans and Wellingborough, but can't understand the need at Rochester, where the speed limits are so low.

Where there are differential speed limits (e.g. up line through Rochester, starting just out of Fort Pitt tunnel on page 4), what are the "classes" of train to which the different limits apply?

Thanks in anticipation.
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Re: East Kent Resignalling Scheme Phase 2 and associated wor

Unread postby Peter Gibbons » Wed Jun 8, 2016 8:40 pm

I think 3 position banner repeaters are gradually becoming common place in preference to two-position ones throughout the rail network not least because they give more information to the driver. The green aspect on a banner repeater signifies the signal it relates to is also displaying a green aspect, and only that. Whilst the speeds are low through Rochester the spacing between signals is also very short. To give an example between Chatham station and Rochester Bridge Junction there were just two signal sections with three aspect signalling. Today there are four signal sections using four aspect signalling.

The speed limit for passenger trains is 30 mph and the Sectional Appendix shows this running from 34 miles 55 chains (east of Chatham Tunnel) to 32 miles 20 chains approximately three quarters of a mile London side of Rochester Bridge Junction towards Sole Street. This applies for both the Up and Down lines

In addition there is a more severe speed limit through the loops at Rochester station of just 15 mph. The line to / from Strood to /from Rochester Bridge Junction carries a speed limit of 20 mph.

There is also a differential speed limit of 25 mph applying to certain types of train applying on the main lines through both the old a new stations. This slightly lower speed limit applies to trains that are NOT passenger trains (loaded or empty), parcels or mail trains (loaded or empty), or light locomotives. The lower speed limit is shown on the signs as the upper of the two speeds on differential signs.
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Re: East Kent Resignalling Scheme Phase 2 and associated wor

Unread postby StockControl » Fri Dec 30, 2016 9:38 am

I would like to know the position of points by number in EKR2 area, I have the numbers but do not know where they are.
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Re: East Kent Resignalling Scheme Phase 2 and associated wor

Unread postby Fast Line Floyd » Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:38 am

StockControl wrote:I would like to know the position of points by number in EKR2 area, I have the numbers but do not know where they are.

Send me a PM with the numbers that you want to know and I'll have a look at the scheme plans for you.
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