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Signal Box Telephones

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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby Richard Pike » Mon Jul 31, 2017 12:21 pm

A similar phone to that in the op with the original external wiring still present. Not that - and M- are linked and M+ has a wire that would go to a suitable tap on the batteries as per the Littleport wiring diagram. As does B-

https://www.flickr.com/photos/32297024@N08/36118956152/
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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby OnlyMe » Mon Jul 31, 2017 1:43 pm

Thank you all for your technical replies there really is a great wealth of knowledge here!

Wired the handset back together (thank you for letting me know i have a slightly irregular handset)

Is there a way to test the bell? I took the bell apart and cleaned all the rust off the two solenoids and their connectors.
Removed and rust and put back together, have a good circuit now..

Added 12v to L1 and L2 (get a tone on handset), added second 12v feed to + and -
Looped a wire from B- to the - block...

Tried pushing in the relay under the plate on the door ehich creates a circuit to the bell but it doesnt fire a solenoid even one way... is my voltage too low i wonder?

12v 3a supplies


Thanks paul
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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby Chris Osment » Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:38 pm

Richard Pike wrote: I can take a photo or three if it helps.

Yes please, whenever you have time :-)
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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby Richard Pike » Mon Jul 31, 2017 4:13 pm

Chris Osment wrote:
Richard Pike wrote: I can take a photo or three if it helps.

Yes please, whenever you have time :-)


Here it is..

https://www.flickr.com/photos/32297024@N08/35452154094/

Do you want the buzzer phone circuit too?
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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby Chris Osment » Mon Jul 31, 2017 4:21 pm

Richard Pike wrote:
Chris Osment wrote:
Richard Pike wrote: I can take a photo or three if it helps.

Yes please, whenever you have time


Here it is..

https://www.flickr.com/photos/32297024@N08/35452154094/

Do you want the buzzer phone circuit too?


Well, why not :-) All grist to the mill.....thanks again
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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby Richard Pike » Mon Jul 31, 2017 4:46 pm

OnlyMe wrote:Thank you all for your technical replies there really is a great wealth of knowledge here!

Wired the handset back together (thank you for letting me know i have a slightly irregular handset)

Is there a way to test the bell? I took the bell apart and cleaned all the rust off the two solenoids and their connectors.
Removed and rust and put back together, have a good circuit now..

Added 12v to L1 and L2 (get a tone on handset), added second 12v feed to + and -
Looped a wire from B- to the - block...

Tried pushing in the relay under the plate on the door ehich creates a circuit to the bell but it doesnt fire a solenoid even one way... is my voltage too low i wonder?

12v 3a supplies


Thanks paul


The bell has a return spring. This usually perishes as it's made from spring steel. I had this problem with a similar bell last night and had to make a new one. I used nickel silver wire and a drill bit the same size as the pivot pin held in a pin vice. this spring also acts as a conductor so you problem may well be in this area. If the pivot makes good electrical contact i have had some success with turning the whole bell assembly round so it acts under gravity.

I'm a little concerned when you say you here a tone with power applied to L1 and L2. It sounds like your power is not smooth. Measure it both on DC as well as AC. Any AC reading will mean there is a ripple voltage.
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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby Richard Pike » Mon Jul 31, 2017 5:04 pm

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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby OnlyMe » Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:23 pm

You guys are extremely good at this!!

http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/galle ... 31226.jpeg

The spring was indeed in past its use by date!

http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/galle ... 11868.jpeg

Bit of brass rod replacement!

So just to confirm the solenoids should fire under 12v or even 9v?

Thanks again Paul
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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby Richard Pike » Mon Jul 31, 2017 7:45 pm

9v should be plenty though you may need to adjust the bell a little. Here's my new spring..

https://www.flickr.com/photos/32297024@N08/36126994772/
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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby OnlyMe » Mon Jul 31, 2017 8:23 pm

Thanks for all the advice, much to the wifes un amusement! I have a ringing clapper!!

So to ring it without using my hand to close the solenoid on the lid, i guess a certain code from another box would come in via + and - that would throw the solenoid over and cause it to ring?

Should it ring constantly ?

Thanks and again apologies for my agonisingly simple questions!
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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby OnlyMe » Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:26 pm

Btw Richard, i see a lot of the box diagrams you have are very close to me, im about 3 miles from the old Three Counties Station!
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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby TseTT » Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:38 pm

No, the phone will be rung by another phone connected to L1 and L2. "L" stands for Line.
There should only ever be a voltage on the line wires when a call button is pressed.
The + and - should have your phones battery connected to it, this is then connected to Line (L1 L2) when a call button is pressed.

And no, it shouldn't ring constantly! :shock:
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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby OnlyMe » Mon Jul 31, 2017 10:13 pm

That now makes sense... removed the constant power so now as a test a 24vdc to l1 and l2 flicks the solenoid and it rings!!, so last question is when someonea calling the phone and pressing the button at the other end should it just ring or make ring-ring-ring sounds?
At the moment its a constant ring

If i lift the receiver it stops which is what i guess would be expected..


:) thanks again im learning fast here!
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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby Richard Pike » Tue Aug 1, 2017 6:33 am

OnlyMe wrote:Btw Richard, i see a lot of the box diagrams you have are very close to me, im about 3 miles from the old Three Counties Station!


I'm about Three miles from Three Counties.
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Re: Signal Box Telephones

Unread postby Richard Pike » Tue Aug 1, 2017 6:58 am

Richard Pike wrote:
OnlyMe wrote:Btw Richard, i see a lot of the box diagrams you have are very close to me, im about 3 miles from the old Three Counties Station!


I'm about Three miles from Three Counties.


The caller would use a code of long and short rings to attract the attention of the waystation he needed to communicate with. Here is a circuit card for Broxbourne to Buntingford.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/32297024@N08/34574273533/

This looks like a very busy circuit with lots of non signalling locations having phones. The person manning each waystation on the circuit would know their code and listen out for it each time the phone rang. It would have been possible to divide the circuit and remove the non signalling locations from the main ringing by using a different polarity ringing current to line and the polar relays being arranged to detect only the right ringing current.

Another refinement could be to use the red button to apply current to say L1 and earth. You would then have three separate ringing conditions on two wires. Speech would be heard in all phones on the circuit but signalboxes would be able to call signalboxes and booking offices and porters could call each other and in addition both parties could use the red button to call the stationmaster or control.

Each phone carries the instruction 'Listen before ringing' If the booking offices were chatting and a signalman had an important call to make he could challenge the users to make his call. Of course anyone using the circuit could listen to any conversation etc.

I have umteen circuits in use here. There is one circuit that goes through to the residence. Traffic between the signalboxes is on the black button. Tea and biscuits can be summoned by the brave on the red button. This only rings the phone in the residence.
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